Custom Drag Springs

[Foose04]

Plan to make some changes on the front end this year. Current setup is pretty horrible for 1/4 fun. 2inch lowering springs that are netting more around 3", just touching the bump stops. The front is very stiff, both pushing down and has almost zero recoil coming up. Struts are lakewood 90/10s.

Currently i'm looking at DJM lowering arms with two inch drop. Should save some weight and switch to a stock spring. I read the v6 springs have a longer coil, so I bought a used set figuring they may hold more energy when compressed.

However this got me thinking what about custom springs. I could then even go with 3-4 drop arms and install a longer spring that stores more energy but keeps the drop at 2". Thoughts?

Also read that trucks leave best if it they start level. It's currently at least 2-3" ass high. That also needs to be addressed. I'm thinking lowering shackles for that, the current slicks will tuck and I can use my load bags to bring it back up on the street. I'm getting about 4" lift in the rear so the Caltrac bars are doing there part putting weight on the axle.


Currently how the truck leaves with a 1.54, also got a 1.52 that day. Best is a few 1.51s.

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Got a lot of info from a cal-trac thread over on YB. This guy seems like the only truck guy I can relate to. Runs Cals and multi-leafs. Was having problems with spinning before the 60 is up and unloading the rear. (same as me) He's leaving with turbo and trans brake at around 3500. Ass High and 3-4 inch of front end travel.

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Update late on he says he got his shit level and some movement up front.

1.37x 60"

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[Foose04]

After some more research looks like only the L camp seem to have it figured out. Hell those JDM drag springs look like they came off a damn Baja sand buggy. The actually raise the truck lol.

Chris you rocking a set of those? Any other L guys got any feedback on them? I'd like to see some installed pictures to get some idea's.

Every inch that bad boy is compressed is 100's of pounds of lift, per side! ..... guess that school bus didn't stop at the GM full size truck camp, I can't find no info drag springs. It's one thing if I didn't think about it, but hell all the chevy guys bitch about not hooking and no one seems to point out this possible solution.

JDM

http://www.teamjdm.com/product_images/n/952/drag_springs__48972_std.jpg

My setup:

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/b6d28cd7.jpg


Looks like it's time to fab something up. :Group Hug:

[LXtasy]

Can you add coilovers to your truck?

[Foose04]

I've asked around and searched, again no options without going full custom.

I'm wondering if a 3-4" drop control arm would allow that L spring to tuck in there. Then check ride height to see if any further trimming is needed to get a good ride height. Can always add a spacer to bring up if needed.

This isn't the actual arm, but you get the idea. http://ebay.carparts.com/prodimages/11057314.jpg

[chrisheltra]

I do have the JDM drag springs. Im not sure if their custom specific to JDM but they're very similar to V6 F150 springs. The V6 springs are way softer and way longer. Everyone has to cut at least one coil off of the drag springs but the longer you keep them the better they transfer weight and lift the front. IMO your going to start to see the limits of the caltracs and have to find an alternative like long bars or ladder bars. You can actually see your rear lifting in the vid in your post which is not what you want and that is due in part to the caltracs. Randy and I both had that issue with them before going with longbars. Do you have adjustable shocks yet?

You back from Germany?

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[Foose04]

Hows the ride on them? Does it bounce around much?

As for Germany, still here for a bit. Ramstein isn't bad though. Got a sweet 2012 BMW 530 rental. The diesel has some grunt down low and the car has so many little gadgets it's crazy. I think it would wipe your butt if you asked it lol. Might try a A6 next month, see what it's all about.

Weather could be better though, this was from tonight. Bottom right..

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_1746.jpg

And see a lot of this when it's time to head out..good old deicing

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_1694.jpg

Now down range isn't as top notch lol, but always could be worse.

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_1691.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_1686.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_1687.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_1689.jpg

[chrisheltra]

Its a little bouncy because my suspension is pretty soft compared to stock but not unbearable. It can be adjusted out for the most part with the QA1's.

[Foose04]

Chris could I bother you for a spring installed picture whenever you get some free time. I been poking around over on LightningRodder (crazy how much good info you all got) and for the life of me can't find a installed picture. Just looking for the perch area and overall installed height.

As far as the Cals go, their all I got right now. I know for sure the front end setup is a unturned rock, after that I may look into other rear end work. That third video the guys is using cals and cuts in the 1.3's at a claimed weight of 4400. So in theory, it should be possible.

Thanks man

[chrisheltra]

Chris could I bother you for a spring installed picture whenever you get some free time. I been poking around over on LightningRodder (crazy how much good info you all got) and for the life of me can't find a installed picture. Just looking for the perch area and overall installed height.

As far as the Cals go, their all I got right now. I know for sure the front end setup is a unturned rock, after that I may look into other rear end work. That third video the guys is using cals and cuts in the 1.3's at a claimed weight of 4400. So in theory, it should be possible.

Thanks man

I dont think I have any pics of what your looking for but Ill see if I can dig one up for you.

[BigdaddyDupree]

park your all stock mustang and pull a tire and get the man a picture.



i love you chris

[chrisheltra]

park your all stock mustang and pull a tire and get the man a picture.



i love you chris

That requires too much work when all I have to do is this.

http://www.lightningrodder.com/forum/showthread.php?t=85284

[Foose04]

Shimmy.... thank u kind sir!

From those pictures it looks like this could be my best bet.

[chrisheltra]

Shimmy.... thank u kind sir!

From those pictures it looks like this could be my best bet.

:bigthumb:

[Foose04]

Recommend a good vender? Hope they don't put SVT stickers all over the box. Already going to have a good sit down talk with the truck before I attempt to adapt them over, along the lines of lets all get along. :razz: I'll call JDM Monday to make sure they don't see a problem with this or if they know someone who's already done it with or without problems.

It's a tough call on the what size drop arm to match them with. My best bet may be to install one and take measurements. Also sounds like the springs take a few miles to settle.

[chrisheltra]

Also sounds like the springs take a few miles to settle.

They do. Dont over cut them because the springs will settle over the coarse of a week or so and you dont want to have to buy another set because you cut too much. If it sits too high for your liking just remove them and take a little more off.

[1BAD4DR]

U can build a set of longbars for less than 200 bucks. Slow94 has a how to thread on lightning rodder and the links where u can buy the bars brackets bolts etc. These help tremendously along with springs and adjustable shocks. Chris is absolutely right about the springs...if u install them don't look at ur truck for a week to decide if u will be happy with the stance because they do settle quite a bit.

[1BAD4DR]

I am currently building a set for my truck so I will keep u posted.
http://www.lightningrodder.com/forum/showthread.php?t=58046&highlight=slow94

[spdracr0]

I have a set of JDM springs here right now that have to be installed. I was hoping to get a little more out of the 60ft to avenge my loss, but get'er right and lets do it again sometime. Would be cool to have 9000 lbs rolling down the 1/4 at around 20 secs combined...

[Foose04]

Sounds good man. Hope nothing jumps out in front of us lol....swerving or stopping...not likely. :razz:

[chrisheltra]

I have a set of JDM springs here right now that have to be installed. I was hoping to get a little more out of the 60ft to avenge my loss, but get'er right and lets do it again sometime. Would be cool to have 9000 lbs rolling down the 1/4 at around 20 secs combined...

If he gets home in time before you install them you should let him borrow them to see if the will fit in his spring cups.

[1BAD4DR]

My buddy owns an 01 gmc extended cab 2wd and when he did his spring swap for towing a huge boat in the front he used f-250 coils in his from an aftermarket dealer. This was about two years ago and the springs were the same part number for a 01-04 superduty. The diameter of the stock springs and the f-250 springs were so close we couldnt tell the difference. I dont see why the jdm ones would be any different. Wouldnt the only difference be the poundage on the spring itself and the diameter of the coils theirselves?

[1BAD4DR]

Unless the f-250 springs are a bigger diameter than the f-150, jdm, v6 springs???? Foose i am planning to raise my truck up a bit by buying new drag springs and cutting them less than the ones on the truck currently so if i get that done before you get back you are more than welcome to mach up my jdm drag springs that are on the truck or even use them if you wanted.

[Foose04]

Hmmm... Good to know and that sounds great that he was able to run the f250's.

About the springs, that's a generous offer and thanks, but I think if I do this I want to run the spring full length and get the correct lower control arm to achieve my ride height. Anything changes though I'll shoot you a PM about trying/buying.

[chrisheltra]

About the springs, that's a generous offer and thanks, but I think if I do this I want to run the spring full length and get the correct lower control arm to achieve my ride height. Anything changes though I'll shoot you a PM about trying/buying.

Thats what I would do.

[1BAD4DR]

No problem just trying to help out. Should be a PITA figuring out everything exactly but once it is it should work great.

[spdracr0]

Thats what I would do.


Make up your mind, yesterday you sya cut em and run em

[chrisheltra]

Make up your mind, yesterday you sya cut em and run em

There are no readily available lowering control arms that I would trust on my truck. So cut your coils unless you plan on buying the stifflers LCA's.

[MonteC]

So cut your coils unless you plan on buying stifflers LCA's.



http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/41816_23969371199_8714_n.jpg

[chrisheltra]

http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/41816_23969371199_8714_n.jpg

I cant see the pic at work but Im sure its funny. Heres the guys site.
http://buystifflers.com/1999to2004.aspx

[Foose04]

Well the V6 springs I ordered last week before this idea came along came in. Had the lady send me some pictures. Not excited about them sitting of the wood floods, but any case. Cat seems to think their suspect as well lol.

She measured them at 16 1/4 tall, 5 3/4 outer diameter, 4" inner. Weight together is 31 pounds.

Spdracr0, any chance you could bother you to take those measurements on those JDM's before you install them?

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/photo89.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/photo90.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/photo88.jpg

[98Camarod]

^^I'm sure if you mentioned them being on the wood floors you'd get the ol "well you wanted me to take the picture!"

[LXtasy]

Have her hold the springs later and you take better pictures.

[MonteC]

Pictures should have been taken in the kitchen.

[Ct.TOPGUN]

I also run the JDM springs. It is too bad that we have to cut them for proper ride height. But the Stifflers adjustable height lower control arms should soon solve that issue. The springs do work well, and with good adjustable shocks are quite streetable.

Foose, I would not worry about the Caltracs. Most of the fastest leaf spring vehicles are on Caltracs.The ones for the Lightning application are a compromise due to exhaust interference issues. That's the main reason they don't work right.


Jim

[chrisheltra]

Foose, I would not worry about the Caltracs. Most of the fastest leaf spring vehicles are on Caltracs.The ones for the Lightning application are a compromise due to exhaust interference issues. That's the main reason they don't work right.


Jim

Ive never seen exhaust interference issues on the several L Ive seen them installed on including my own. Yes they are on some of the fastest cars. That being said Im not saying he cant get them to work Im just suggesting a route that I think is easier in the long run.

[Foose04]

Update, I got a hold of Jim over at JDM. He said he couldn't say yes or no on fitment and directed me to R&H in New Jersey who builds them. I then called over there and spoke with Frank Jr. for a good bit. He wants to crunch the numbers and come up with something that will be setup for the GM camp. So, that's all good news and thanks again for the help up to this point. I'll keep the thread updated on what develops.

As for the Cals, I know they work well on cars but are also designed to be on a Mono Leaf setup. I've removed my overload, and run a dual leaf setup. I've thought about going down to a single, but I still tow the boat. Did you guys try to run them with 3-4 leafs? If so that could be some of the reason they don't work as well.

There is also a long list of other things they can make them not work if not setup right. As for now, I'll see how far I can go with them with a new springs up front. I really think a mid 1.4 will be possible, but I like being optimistic. :cheers

[Ct.TOPGUN]

Ive never seen exhaust interference issues on the several L Ive seen them installed on including my own. Yes they are on some of the fastest cars. That being said Im not saying he cant get them to work Im just suggesting a route that I think is easier in the long run.

That is because they compromised the geometry to prevent the interference issue. Regular F150 setups are much different.


Most Lightning guys have avoided these due to poor feedback and the fact that simple long bars(torque arms) work so well for us. But the Hotchkiss leafs are the ones most often used. I believe they are 2 leaf.

[LXtasy]

Caltracs WERE NOT designed around a mono leaf setup. It doesn't hurt to have a split mono setup though. It also doesn't hurt to have leaf spring sliders also. One good part on top of another just progressively makes your suspension work even better.

And if you do go to a mono leaf setup, I would NOT do it on stock leaf springs. That will make everything worse. Ride will be horrible, load rating will drop, and ride height will be adjusted also. Just a plain bad idea.

If they make a split mono design than yes go for it (you could still tow I am sure). But with my search I do not see a split mono setup for a fullsize silverado/sierra. Probably because many have not shown interest to manufacturers to produce such item.

What shocks do you have in the rear? are they adjustable. I may have overlooked that piece of information.

[chrisheltra]

But the Hotchkiss leafs are the ones most often used.

Thats what I use. :bigthumb:

[Foose04]

I do have single way adjustable on the rear, 90/10's on the front. When I said the Cals are designed around single, I mean Calvert Racing recommends mono split leaf setup, sell mono split, and from reading on YB most car guys going very low 1.x are mono cars.

I think the rear is working ok right now and agree running a single would change a lot of things going on back there. I'm ready to swap springs up front, new A arms, and maybe shackle the rear to bring the over all stance level.

Didn't read much on the leaf spring sliders other then seeing some pictures. How do those work?

[chrisheltra]

Unfortunately soon your going to have to figure if you need a tow truck or a race truck. Please excuse me I a bit loopy on my sleeping meds.

[LXtasy]

Sliders help with weight transfer to help lower 60ft times. As you launch the rear squats. The leafsprings "flatten" out so to speak. The sliders allow the leafs to really go level on launch. Less chance of binding up which can cause your leafsprings to want to dearch themselves and get warped.

[LXtasy]

I believe your front shocks are actually an issue. Your suspension IMO, is a little too loose.

Have you tried stiffen the rear shocks up? You need to stiffen the suspension up as you are unloading the truck because your shocks are not stiff enough to keep it from unloading. If you were blowing the tires off on the launch than you are too stiff.

[MonteC]

Fuck all your tech. That stiffler picture was fucking gold!

[Derek]

Pictures should have been taken in the kitchen.

Lmfao

[Foose04]

Little update. The guys over at R&H never got back with me after about a week of waiting, so decided to keep searching. After reading some good reviews on YB about a Santhuff's, I ended up ordering a set of their Landrum "Hi Energy Racing Spring". The spec's are 18", 250lb spring. They said it is going to sit lower then stock, so I shouldn't need LCA. I'm hoping lower then stock is about 2-3" at most, if not I'll have to add a spring spacer to get the level front to rear I want. Also talked the woman into finding my shackles, lol. Good times and hot damn, got lucky my factory lowering kit is adjustable and has another slot to drop the rear another inch. Also bought their spring tool as he said installing these things can make you @sshole pucker.

Look forward now to getting home and see her new stance. I "may" end up needing an adjustable front struts for more control, but well see how she does first.

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/spring1.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/spring3.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/spring2.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/spring4.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/shackle.jpg

Current stance on track tires.

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/Stance-1.jpg

[spdracr0]

Nice, wondring why I did not think of Santhuff, those guys know their stuff...When you gonna be back??

[Foose04]

Hope to be back in the next few weeks, but that's always subject to change.

[chrisheltra]

Cool.

Home much did they set you back?

[Foose04]

Springs were 188, but he gave me a little off the top for Military. Nice of them to do that and also said if they sit to low/high give them a call back and we'll get it right. So thumbs up so far to Santhuff's.

[chrisheltra]

Thats a damn good price for the improvement in weight transfer and traction they should give you.

[Foose04]

Yeah not to bad. I'll likely sell the old ones to someone just looking to go lower to get some coin back as well.

[Foose04]

Adding in a little extra rubber on the back. Going up to a 30" and a radial wall, hope it helps the cause.

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/photo14.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/photo21-1.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/photo16.jpg

[1BAD4DR]

very nice...should work well with the suspension upgrades.

[Foose04]

Update, springs = fail. Truck got about a 5" drop out them, these heavy chevy's are...well heavy. It was about tucked with a 1" spacer installed. This is without me in the truck. Looks like i'm going to try the v6 route, see what happens.

Also while on topic of fail, I did a fresh swap on all fluids and was on my way to installing some better axles out back and noticed my tru-trac is hating life.

How much longer till this thing goes boom? Right now there isn't any metal in the housing, just some flakes in the oil. Works fine, no noises yet.

I got a lot of upgrades in this rear and would like to stay 8.5/8.6, whats next a full locker? Just like to keep it alive with about 100 more HP/TQ on it.

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/554d2adb.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/7a3ff9e0.jpg
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http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/418d3d2d.jpg

[chrisheltra]

I swapped my TT for a locker and love it. Can the company who sold you the springs get you longer ones?

[Foose04]

That was their big dogs. Their giving me a full refund, but of i'm out shipping. I sent Gerald a message, but it looks like that could be my future as well. If the weather gets better it may still see another track visit first though.

[chrisheltra]

Just cruising around the internet and saw this. Think it could help you in your application?

http://www.santhuffshocks.com/springs.html