Introduction/ Turbo GM Truck Project

[Foose04]

Hey guys. New to this forum, but figured I'd share couple Vid's and my latest project. Some of you might know me from my 10 second black eagle talon here is charleston, sc. Anyways, new project is my 2004 GMC Sierra RST, designed by chip foose. I liked the 67mm turbo so much on the talon, I decided to put on the truck to.

Talon Vids:

10 Second runs:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yB9kDxXRLgw

570HP AWD Mustang Dyno:
http://www.youtube.com/user/rmelcher03#p/u/7/IAnivGoutXE


To be honest, truck is a wimp right now. Has a little 4.8, most GM guys say pull it and go big. I decided to boost it instead.

Base line dyno video today: 243HP/262TQ
http://www.youtube.com/user/rmelcher03#p/u/0/iw86tqYgB2M

Hope to have the turbo and cam in within next couple weeks. It will be tuned with on E85 and no less then 400HP. I'll post a video of the new dyno and maybe some highway burnouts. :razz:

-Rob

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/265f_3.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/Picture019.jpg

[BigdaddyDupree]

nice rides man i have seen the truck at SSS

[Matts94Z28]

I used to see the truck on base at the gym around this time last year. Looks good.

[Mike]

Welcome to the site.

[blkscls1z]

Nice vehicles. Welcome to the site.

[Ronald]

Welcome

[Whaler]

Nice rides. Welcome to the site.

[Harry]

Welcome

[Illusions]

Nice rides and vid's. Welcome to the forums too!

[LXtasy]

Welcome Rob. You got my attention with you turboing the FS. PLEASE do a build thread on it. Truck looks killer. I remember you with your car years ago. You don't know me, but I remember you trying to race a Red Mach1 one night when it was in the 30's one night.

[ForceFed4g63]

Welcome! Nice to see another DSM on here!

[Magoo]

Welcome to the forums Rob, bout time you made it on here.

[Silver-Dollar]

Good to see another GM truck on board. 400hp out of a 4.8 is definitely pushing it. The E85 will help.

[LXtasy]

Good to see another GM truck on board. 400hp out of a 4.8 is definitely pushing it. The E85 will help.

Turbo. So I think it is easily obtainable.

[Foose04]

Thanks guys for the nice welcome. I figure I know some of you in person, but I don't roam forums to often any more. Ones you buy a house toys with wheels seem to get put on the back burner. :?

Hows the stang running Magoo?

Truck will be getting LS6 (z06) cam,springs, timing chain, and pushrods installed this weekend. Also, HPTuner Pro came in last night, got to figure that out next.

Bad thing is I leave for the desert mid March, so I got to get this project moving.

[91notch]

Welcome man!

[Derek]

you been here awhile?

[Silver-Dollar]

Also, save some coins for a new transmission, specially if it is an automatic 4l60e.

[Foose04]

Update...

Well I'm currently deployed, but i'll be back the first of June. I got the truck running and then I had to head out. Anyways, here's some build pictures. Never really got to tune it, but I can say i'm digging the turbo/v8 fun for the daily driver. =)

Mods include:
LS6 cam/Valve Springs
T4 T67/P, in a .81 A/R
Tial Bov/FMIC
80lb injectors (850cc)
Ls1 fuel rails/8an feed line/E85
Ls1 electric fans
Walbo255 with Kenny Bell BAP
Hptuners Pro, logging LC-1 Wideband/2Bar
Eaton True-Trac posi (still needs installed)

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0160.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/StockDyno.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0071-1.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/NewStuff.jpg

[Foose04]

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0099.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0213.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0242.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0205.jpg

[Foose04]

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0215.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0214.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0206.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/0314001437.jpg

[Foose04]

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0253.jpg

[Vette77guy]

looks good !!!!!

[minytrker]

Looks good. I wouldnt have used butt connectors on my injectors if it were mine.

[Foose04]

Looks good. I wouldnt have used butt connectors on my injectors if it were mine.

Yeah, I had solder gun in hand till I noticed I would have to be sitting inside the engine bay to solder 16 wires. Then I punked out. Hope I can get away with it, I'll find out.

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0216.jpg

[toslow]

Whos driving the truck Rob. I saw it creepin a few times.

[chrisheltra]

Whos driving the truck Rob. I saw it creepin a few times.

Thought I have too.:hide:

[Foose04]

Lol, who ever it is I hope they put some new tires on the back before I get home. :razz:

[bambooi]

I see you have ls6 springs in there. I read some people's springs (even on an all stock car) failed on the corvette forum. I changed mine out as precautionary. Just a little fyi.

[1998ta__1991rs]

how much power did it make? im hoping that graph was a baseline before the work

[minytrker]

I see you have ls6 springs in there. I read some people's springs (even on an all stock car) failed on the corvette forum. I changed mine out as precautionary. Just a little fyi.

I already tried telling him that before the cam swap. My bother broke 3 ls6 valve springs in his truck with the same cam.

[minytrker]

how much power did it make? im hoping that graph was a baseline before the work

Its a really rough graph for sure. That must be un-tuned or stock.

[Foose04]

First post guys and come on now, have a little faith in the chevy.


Base line dyno video today: 243HP/262TQ
http://www.youtube.com/user/rmelcher03#p/u/0/iw86tqYgB2M

[Foose04]

A quick search on performancetrucks.net for "broken valve" brings up valve spring failers from PRC, Comp and other big names all within the last year. Reliability and LS6 springs seem to hold there own for the FI guys running a smaller cam and there is quite a few on that forum.

With that said, i'm ok with running these in my DD and mostly timid driving style. I'll be sure to post if I manage to break one.

[minytrker]

The reason you search didnt come up with ALOT of broken ls6 valve springs is because MOST dont run them. My brother has a 4x4 that doesnt get drove hard, 2 springs broke at idle ans one at 70mph on the interstate. Hopefully when you have a spring break it doesnt take out your motor.

[Foose04]

Thanks for your opinion.

[1998ta__1991rs]

A quick search on performancetrucks.net for "broken valve" brings up valve spring failers from PRC, Comp and other big names all within the last year. Reliability and LS6 springs seem to hold there own for the FI guys running a smaller cam and there is quite a few on that forum.

With that said, i'm ok with running these in my DD and mostly timid driving style. I'll be sure to post if I manage to break one.


with those ls6 springs dont expect to run over about 5-6psi, the ls6 springs just do not have enough seat pressure on them, im only running around 14psi on my car and ive maxed out my PRC dual kit.

[minytrker]

Thanks for your opinion.

It's not really an opinion, more fact based. I have been messing with ls stuff since it came out. All I work on and build is ls based cars and trucks. Done more cams swaps than I can count, have 100's of hours on the dyno testing. But hey since the truck forum didn't say alot of people have problems then go and roll the dice.

[98Camarod]

A quick search on performancetrucks.net for "broken valve" brings up valve spring failers from PRC, Comp and other big names all within the last year. Reliability and LS6 springs seem to hold there own for the FI guys running a smaller cam and there is quite a few on that forum.

With that said, i'm ok with running these in my DD and mostly timid driving style. I'll be sure to post if I manage to break one.

You have to also think about the boost. The stress isn't just going to come from the cam...

[Matts94Z28]

I see some issues in the near future with the LS6 springs.

[Foose04]

with those ls6 springs dont expect to run over about 5-6psi, the ls6 springs just do not have enough seat pressure on them, im only running around 14psi on my car and ive maxed out my PRC dual kit.

This combo isnt something new, guys have made over 500HP on the same cam/springs. Here's just one link I bookmarked because he also has the little 4.8L, Ls6 spring and small cam. This is thru an auto at 11psi, same turbo/manifold I run. However, there are other dyno threads and feedback I based my choice from on running this setup. Again, i'll let you guys know if I have any issue's. Worst case, she drops a valve and I'll have a reason to put lq4 in and add a few millimeters to the turbo. Not really that worried about it to be honest.

http://www.performancetrucks.net/forums/showthread.php?t=407439&highlight=LS6+cam
505HP/523TQ
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y57/Kbracing96/12-15-07Dynoday.jpg

[bwelch]

atleast when the spring fails you have a reason to put a lq4 in it!

[1998ta__1991rs]

all i can say is good luck to you, im not downing your setup in any way, it looks very nice, but i can say if you base everything you do off of what you read on ls1tech or performance trucks, you will end up spending a lot more money than necessary, ive been working on ls1's since i was 14 and lorenz has more expierence than i do with them, and im sure that he will agree that half the people on those forums are complete idiots and have no idea what they are talking about. heck look at greg even, he's wasted $1,000's on his car and it still isnt right.

[1998ta__1991rs]

if you want some real lsx based forced induction suggestions contact josh at kentucky turbo or jose at forced inductions, they have been into boosted ls1 motors since the 90's when they were brand new technology

[Foose04]

Well, IM HOME! for now, leave again in September...damnit!


So after some GF time and a few beers, on to the red toy. I got here pretty well dialed in on a safe, fun tune. Currently running E85, 14 degree timing from 3.5k-6k, 8-9PSI and 12.1 a/r's. Let me tell you she's a hand full, looking forward to better tires though and more boost.

Crappy cell Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbZqGVe8zGI

Cleaned it up for a couple new pictures.

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0415.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0412.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0421.jpg



However, after about 2 days of beating on it like i was gettting paid to do it, I got this on a 4th gear pull.
Driveshaft delete Mod. I was on the phone with Frank at DriveShaftShop all morning, telling him about my little project. I have a 4inch Aluminum shaft that will be here on Friday so the good times can roll once again.

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/0525001721.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/0525001722.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/downsized_0525001722a.jpg

[98Camarod]

If you haven't paid for it already, I'd contact joint and clutch. They do great work

[1998ta__1991rs]

If you haven't paid for it already, I'd contact joint and clutch. They do great work

x2, and you can get it the same day

also where are you buying e85? i want to run it in mine

[AverageJoe]

E85 is at the station next to showzone.

[ElecTech]

E85 is at the station next to showzone.

x2 and I think that is the only station selling it in town.

there are a couple in Walterboro and one in Saint George

[LXtasy]

what drop do you have on that truck? wheel/tire size.

[Foose04]

Ground Force Kit 9937, 1.3 front, 3 rear. Foose Speedster rims. 9.5inch
Currently have 275/45/20's, sumitoto htr's.

I gave clutch and joint a call. Best the could do was next monday, so Driveshaftshop.com got my business. They're up in NC and have a good rep on all there HD race shafts. I don't need nothing to crazy, just something that stays together.

[1998ta__1991rs]

did the rearend and transmission survive it? alot of times itll mess the tailshaft up

[ElecTech]

did the rearend survive it? alot of times itll mess the tailshaft up

I usually asked my GF's this the next day. :bigthumb:

[LXtasy]

I usually asked my GF's this the next day. :bigthumb:

post rep

[clubracergt1]

I like the driveshaft delete. Less rotating mass. :D

[Carlrx7]

ive always 'heard' rumors about, beware the 10 second talon, nice to see it does exist.

[Silver-Dollar]

Currently have 275/45/20's, sumitoto htr's.

How do you like these? Have any problems wth balancing? Looking at picking up a set from tire kingdom.

[toslow]

I can tell you they don'y get traction even froma 100 Roll

[Foose04]

Hey Carl, well i'm happy to confirm some humors I guess lol. About the driveshaft, I got a video of it letting go. Looks like I was going a little faster then 100 area.

Silver-dollar, the tires are ok. My review would be they last a long time (35,000+) , horrible in rain, and now that my truck grew a pair, there not enough tire for me.

Here's the driveshaft removal video. I was playin with a local Audi TT guy running 27-28psi he said. Not sure on the turbo though. Only reason I stayed in it was because I had to feather it up to 100 or so, then I started pullin his ass with my barn door truck at high speeds. Ow well, new driveshaft is in tonight, awesome turn around from DSS. I ordered it tuesday afternoon. Had it at my door step thursday. Pretty damn good in my book. New top speed according to Driveshaftshop is around 160 on this 4inch shaft. Hope to have some 305 nitto 555r's soon and my locker goes in next tuesday. Then i'm going TT hunting with money in my pocket =P

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qaXWlPuykc

Another funny thing that night, we ran across a bike drive along on interstate. My girlfriend was like "Let race that"... I was like, sweety this isn't the talon. LoL...she said what about when it's turned up? I said, "well leave those little two wheels alone in big red" =P

[Foose04]

Driveshaftshop, looks to be a really nice piece.

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0440.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0442.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0443.jpg

[Foose04]

Here's mine friend Eaton, hope he helps move this sled forward. =P

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0444.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0445.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/IMG_0446.jpg

[Silver-Dollar]

I have heard nothing but good things about the Truetrac, both from street/strip to off-road use. I have been eyeballing those for a while (long wish list).

[Carlrx7]

are you going to any of the car gatherings this weekend? id like to check out the truck!

[Foose04]

Hey Carl, yeah I'll prolly head out the K-mart meet area tonight. I'm feeling a little froggy though, might dyno today some where. Trucks running pretty good right now at 11psi, 11.8's a/f, 15.5/ timing... I don't really want to drive aroud beating on her much higher, but I wouldn't mind doing a couple pulls on rollers around 15psi and 17-18timing.

[bwelch]

Cops are gonna be out. I wouldn't do anything stupid

[LXtasy]

I might have to ride out there tonight and check out your truck. I have been eyeing the truetrac also. Is it fairly easy to install or should I get a professional to do it?

[Foose04]

To be honest I wimped out on putting the Truetrac in myself. I really don't want to have another weekend like last weekend where my drivetrain detonates on the damn highway. I talked to JP Williams from LSX tuning and he recommended a guy, Gerald. (843-509-3838) He's a local guy, gave him a call and seems to have installed a lot of these things. He's putting mine in next tuesday, costing me $300 but I've heard that's about right.

[LXtasy]

Yea, I know Gerald lol. He is GEARMESH on this board.

[Carlrx7]

i wonder how much he would charge to slip in some 3.90's in the vette?

[LXtasy]

I am sure since its a vette that gerald will be up on par with everything else offered for that car and be around 30 times higher :thumbsup:

[red99pony]

gerald does great work. i have talked to many others that he has done work for and have not found 1 complaint. real nice guy to talk to also. i'm going to let him do my rear gears real soon.

[Foose04]

Thanks for picking on me in second gear tonight guys, not cool. =P Nice meeting some other turbo GM guys. Like to check out the TA sometime.

[MonteC]

I might have to ride out there tonight and check out your truck. I have been eyeing the truetrac also. Is it fairly easy to install or should I get a professional to do it?

Easy install.

[1998ta__1991rs]

Thanks for picking on me in second gear tonight guys, not cool. =P Nice meeting some other turbo GM guys. Like to check out the TA sometime.

only way i would have had a slight chance, lol

and carl, gears in a vette? may as well buy a DTE complete diff, its not cheap to do.

[Foose04]

How many pounds you got that girl running?

[Foose04]

Couple video's of 1st and 2nd...Not much forward movement going on here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukLjDCxuc9E



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqLU5j6WON8

[toslow]

heard the red beast got bullied by a DURAMAX. Guess that'll teach ya lol.

[slowgreen99]

heard the red beast got bullied by a DURAMAX. Guess that'll teach ya lol.

It was fun. E85 stinks though. We couldnt find any cars to play with the Durty so Zac asked Rob if he wanted to.

[toslow]

E85 is smells great compared to a rich ass pump gas tune thats for sure.
Im pretty use to it. So are there vids anywhere.

So I bet the duramax won't go from a 100 roll lol:poke:

[1998ta__1991rs]

E85 is smells great compared to a rich ass pump gas tune thats for sure.
Im pretty use to it. So are there vids anywhere.

So I bet the duramax won't go from a 100 roll lol:poke:


haha, no

[gearmesh, inc.]

If you ever get to having to do something with those valve springs, check into a camshaft company called Cam Motion @ http://www.cammotion.com/.

These guys make turbo specific cams and matching springs to go with them. I have seen a few turbo cars that have switched to their cams from the typical off the shelf N/A grinds and picked up significant power increases. The specs for their turbo cams look weird as compared to N/A cams. Intake durations are longer than the exhaust durations. Exhaust valve opening is delayed some so that on the exhaust stroke the piston actually starts heading up some before the exhaust valve opens. This gives more of a "kick" pulse to spool the turbo up quicker and harder. Lobe separation angles are even wider in order to eliminate overlap. Overlap with a turbo setup will result in reversion and dilution of your intake charge. Think of overlap with a turbo as EGR on steroids since the exhaust is pressurized up to the turbo.

[Magoo]

Hows the stang running Magoo?



Sorry just saw this man, the stang has been "under construction" for the last two years essentially. It's out of fuel and I haven't taken the time to upgrade the fuel system. I'm going to convert to E85, just need the bigger injectors and pumps. Haven't really driven it much in the last two years, maybe 1000 miles total. Shouldn't be much longer though hopefully before it's back out breakin hearts :D

ive always 'heard' rumors about, beware the 10 second talon, nice to see it does exist.

It is just that, a rumor.

How do you like these? Have any problems wth balancing? Looking at picking up a set from tire kingdom.

They are garbage, they're a cheap ass tire for a reason. No traction and they burn up pretty quickly.

[Silver-Dollar]

Glad I didnt spring for them yet.

[Foose04]

Update: True-Trac is in and I love it. It's nice knowing the rear is actually trying to move the truck foward.

Also, even though i'm 600+ miles away from home this week, my friends talked me into dyno'in the heavy chevy. Made three pulls.

Couple issues kept me from better numbers. These include a maxed wastegate spring at 10psi on the dyno. Not sure why, but I can get 11-12 on the streets, but only 10psi on rollers. Also had some HPtuners problems. Truck was shutting down at 130MPH (5700rpms) not sure why since my fuel cut is set at 6300. The throttle % just closes up though, so I have to figure that out.

First pull was in third gear to see how it looked.
Netted: 490HP/469TQ

Then 4th Gear:
Second pull: 506/525TQ
Third: 528/528

Over all, very happy with the truck at this boost level. I would have been more then happy though to take it to 15psi area if the wastegate would have played along. Maybe next time

Slapped little video together: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeZFdAHAaHY

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/0608002134.jpg

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/0608002149.jpg

[jmd]

nice.

[toslow]

Congrads bro. Not sure if you tried to text me but my phone is down.

[Silver-Dollar]

Maybe the load difference from street and dyno causing the difference in psi. Got to factor in pushing 4300lbs through the air @ 100+ mph.

[Foose04]

Maybe the load difference from street and dyno causing the difference in psi. Got to factor in pushing 4300lbs through the air @ 100+ mph.

Thanks guys, and thats a good point silver. I know the truck makes more power on the street as well. I was only using 81% injector on the 528/528 runs. I'm around 98-100% on the streets with the extra 1-2psi boost pressure.

Ow well, its worthless if you cant put it down right? I'm really limited with 20's, but with my brakes I can't go smaller. Plus this is my DD, it has to stop somewhere. So the 275's are getting swapped to 305' nitto 555r's. Maybe it will hook in second at the track??

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s192/blackhawkawd91/0607001954.jpg

[minytrker]

Nice numbers. Thats pretty common to see 1-2psi less on the dyno unless you its load bearing. Sometimes you can cheat and strap the vehicle down really tight and get them to make the correct boost.

[bambooi]

Nice numbers!

[gearmesh, inc.]

Nice numbers out of just a little ole 4.8 liter mill. Since your truck is a limited edition of sorts, I was expecting to at least see a factory limited slip unit when I took the cover off......NOT! Just a plain open carrier! WTF?

Good to hear you can get some power to the ground now. Keep us posted.

[Foose04]

I been giving this some thought, looking for opinions. Can the old little 4.8 handle a few pulls to clinch the 600HP mark for nothing more then shits and giggles & maybe a few track runs later on.

Current setup made: 528Hp/528Tq

600hp Plan: remove the Kenny bell boost a pump, install another walbro 255, install stronger wastegate spring, turn timing down to around 15, and turn boost up till 600hp is reached.

Thoughts and or opinions?

Some guys pointed out the ls6 valve springs being weak. How can I tell on the dyno when there not staying shut? Also, still have stock head studs, gaskets, and rod bolts. Any one push these to failure, assuming tune was correct?

Other fun stuff, the true-track and 305 DR's hook awesome, even first gear. However, truck isn't track capable AT ALL with this 5speed nv3500. It refuses to shift into 3rd after a hard 2nd gear pull. This trans only has 25k miles on it, running GM fluids. After the HP is made, some kind of transmission swap will be done, either stick or auto.

[gearmesh, inc.]

Sounds like time to go auto! The dyno may show a little less horsepower with one, but you will be faster.

You can build up boost against the converter before you launch. Then you can see if those new drag radials can really hold!

[bwelch]

you should call out one of these lightnings in the skreet from a roll

[AverageJoe]

Why wasn't this done at Showzone where you got your baseline numbers?

[Foose04]

I sent you a PM Gerald.

As for the dyno, I was at home on leave (ohio) when a few high school buds talked me into dyno'ing. Plus when people ask how much HP the truck makes, it's hard to say around 500HP without having a dyno sheet to back it up. The truck will see Showzones dyno before to long, but will be up a few PSI from the dynojet pulls.

As for running some fords from a roll, I don't mind. I hear most are 10 second rides around here, so they prolly don't want to beat up on my little chevy aways.